Crock of shit email

[Lisa]

QUOTE (alasdairm @ Mar 13 2004, 10:48)

exactly! alasdair

am I right No but seriously, we will not know if they have been taught a lesson or not, until they are released back into society, it is a chance we take.

 

I hope that have learnt & have changed, but from the bottom of my heart as a mother of 3, I can honestly say, id rather see them rot, sorry

[Louise]

QUOTE (miss_diddy @ Mar 13 2004, 10:52)

QUOTE (alasdairm @ Mar 13 2004, 10:48) exactly! alasdair am I right No but seriously, we will not know if they have been taught a lesson or not, until they are released back into society, it is a chance we take.   I hope that have learnt & have changed, but from the bottom of my heart as a mother of 3, I can honestly say, id rather see them rot, sorry me too, and i think if you ask any parent chances are they might say the same thing.   it has nothing to do with giving people a second chance, im all for that, but i dont beleive they deserve a second chance, little jamie didnt get a second chance, nor did his parents.   they have there life mapped out for them, houses, jobs, new id, money.........whats mr & mrs bulger left with..................a headstone, newspaper cuttings, photos and the thoughts of what repulsive things they did to jamie

[Guest Kether]

Bad stuff happens Louise, deal with it. You can try and justify locking people up all their lives by talking about poor mummy and daddy with their gravestone and newspaper cuttings. It's easy to get caught up in the emotion and thinking how you'd feel if it happened to your kid.

 

I'm not defending what Venables and Thompson did but I do think they deserve the chance to live their lives now. I'm sure if they could they would turn the clocks back but they can't. All that's left is for them to try and live their lives to the best of their ability. They have to live with what they've done.

[Guest Kether]

http://www.cps.org.uk/youthjustice.pdf

 

Taken from a speech by Oliver Letwin in 2002.

 

QUOTE

You will recall that, for the UK's Youth Offending Institutes, the latest figures show that 75% of young offenders reoffend within two years of release and those figures are only for those juveniles who are caught. 75%. Now let me contrast that figure for a moment with a Young Offenders Reformatory in Ankara, Turkey a country not normally associated with a Hampstead liberals or a liberal penal policy! At this Reformatory, just 3% of those released had been reconvicted of an offence within four years. Yet the inmates of this Reformatory were convicted for severe crimes. The Governor of the Reformatory states: "This place is more like a school than a prison because we believe this project will be one that will help the children who have committed crimes return to the community as normal citizens." This Reformatory succeeds because it is embedded in the local community. It is the very opposite of a child jail. The young people leave the prison campus every day to work in local businesses or study in local schools. The Reformatory is partly staffed by local volunteers. Although there is tremendous opportunity to escape, very few children do. Why? Partly because the conditions of the Reformatory are pleasant and provide replacements for all the things that were notably absent throughout the young person's upbringing: positive support, education and sustenance. However, there is one important threat that hangs over these juvenile offenders: they know that they will be sent to a harsh closed prison most likely to the end of their sentence if they run away. They know what this closed prison is like due to the fact that they were detained there before trial proceedings.

 

Picking up on the reoffending rate issue.

 

People were complaining about Venables and Thompson being allowed trips to Old Trafford and the like. It seems to me that if our system was more about education and less about locking people up then the reoffending rate would be lower.

 

3% in Turkey, it's amazing. I'm actually very shocked by the juvenile reoffending rate here but then our legal system is pretty poor when dealing with them. It seems that they have to do something pretty damned serious before going to jail and a lot of juvenile anti-social behaviour is pretty much unpolicable as the laws currently stand.

 

I believe that most people can be rehabilitated given the chance. I also believe that a lot of juvenile serial offenders grow out of it as they approach adulthood as they settle down and get jobs. I don't agree with the concensus of most on here saying once an offender always an offender.

Edited March 13, 2004 by Kether

[Lisa]

but why should they get a second chance Kether?? Im sorry but im with Lou on this, what chance did that little Jamie Bulger get eh??? Or the family they ripped apart!!

[alasdairm]

QUOTE (Louise @ Mar 13 2004, 03:05)

it has nothing to do with giving people a second chance, im all for that, but i dont beleive they deserve a second chance

that just doesn't make any sense at all... you say you're all for it but then immediately say the opposite.

 

alasdair

[Louise]

theres giving a second chance for burglary and petty offences and such like ...theres a big difference........................but this just takes the piss, ......there is more thought gone into the criminals lifes that the family of the victims

Edited March 14, 2004 by Louise

[big_ee69]

many 1000's of children on this planet, are tortured to death, esp in the third world. they all don't deserve to die. they all deserve a happy life. they all don't deserve to be brutalised and raped, and killed. But they are, every f*cking day.

 

what is most horrible about this case, and similar cases, when photogenic white children are murdered, is that the vermin that own our our 'newspapers' & media choose to senstaionalise, and hound, and rake over, and print, and re-print, and fan the flames, of the type of hysteria you see above,because it sells more newspapers. Not for one second because they give a shit about the poor child who was killed or his family.

And whilst they could do a great deal, they do very little if nothing to fight injustice, poverty, and the brutalisation, rape and murder of little children outside of our four little walls.

if you think i am talking crap, spend a night in the favellas of sao paulo, or roadsides in calcutta, or any number of shanty towns in city's in the world. If u make it though the night come back and tell me, i'm wrong.

[Dave M]

 

 

ooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

[alasdairm]

QUOTE (Louise @ Mar 13 2004, 16:05)

there is more thought gone into the criminals lifes that the family of the victims

i don't accept that at all. i think you are conveniently forgetting (or ignoring?) the axis of time?

 

alasdair

[tommy]

Thompson and Venables cannot be mentaly right to have done something like that. I would say that they both probably have something wrong with them, and I'd be very sceptical as to whether they are both now of sound mind.

 

The length of the sentence shows that you can literally get away with murder in the UK, and can't be constructive in reducing crime of any kind, since people who (that way inclined) see these very short sentences for things like murder, they may well think less of burgling a house.

 

The family of Jamie Bulger don't know where Thompson and Venables are, what their names are now or what they will look like grown up.

[Maria]

Some say "people can change when given the chance".

 

It's true. But these two kids I don't think can or will ever change. I mean, they could be looking at some toddler on the street when passing by and still having the thoughts in their heads about what they did to the little kid they murdered, and probab;y thrive off what they did, thoughts of enjoyment going through their head. It could be their ultimate FANTACY, yet, none of us know that.

 

Either way, for the crimes they commited, they should never see the light of day.

 

What they did is unforgivable. The law can sometimes be to unfair and IMO, I think "punishment" should be REVALUATED because I think, in some areas, it's undoubtly APPAULING.

 

Just because they went into REHAB or whatever you call it, doesn't mean for one minute they have INDEFFINATLY changed. And if the people who released those spawn of evil human beings, then I think they are being VERY naieve (sp).

 

No-one knows what goes on in another persons mind.

 

That is all.

[Maria]

To TORTURE and MURDER and innocent child, says in itself, that they were "not right" in the head.

 

Makes me fucking SICK, to think, that everything will be "OK" now they have new identites.

 

[Maria]

And I will also add, the law or the people who released the two evil fucks, can't think THAT much of the family of Jamie, because if it were me, I think I would slowly go INSANE knowing that they fucked up bastards, are free, after the sickening crimes they commited on my son.

 

x 1000000000000

[alasdairm]

QUOTE (Maria @ Mar 14 2004, 05:16)

No-one knows what goes on in another persons mind.

indeed maria. don't you see that you can use this statement to support both sides of the argument...

 

alasdair