smacking & punishement for kids

[Lisa]

QUOTE (LiquidEyes @ Jun 1 2004, 17:09)

If you choose to get so drunk that you physically can't say "no" (i.e. your drinks weren't spiked) then you've gotta take what's coming to you.

What a load of bollox LE!! Im sorry, but NO IS NO at te end of the day

[LiquidEyes]

Re-read what I said Lisa.

[Lisa]

QUOTE (LiquidEyes @ Jun 2 2004, 10:19)

Re-read what I said Lisa.

I did, but that still isnt reason, for a man to take advantage, so i disagree with your got whats coming to you comment Andy, thats all!!

[LiquidEyes]

QUOTE (Kether @ Jun 2 2004, 00:30)

ADHD and SAD are medical conditions. ... ADHD has genetic links and SAD can be detected by chemical imbalances in the brain. Why are you so sceptical?

Although I did phrase my comments quite provocatively, I do submit that there is a grey area between what is and isn't an "illness".

 

But rather than pigeon-holing everything as either "an illness" or "not an illness", ask yourself: what is the purpose of acknowledging a given condition?

 

Why not acknowledge "naughtiness" as an official condition? If we found that there was a gene linked to mischievous behaviour, should we add "mischievous behaviour syndrome" to the list?

 

How about "dumb-assed bastard syndrome"?

 

It is suspected that certain genes make you more likely to be a sociopath or become a criminal. Does that mean that people who have this gene are more justified if they commit criminal acts?

 

Central to this debate is the matter of personal responsibility.

[LiquidEyes]

Lisa,

 

Treza said "i shouldnt have got so drunk, i couldnt say no!!!!!!"

Ergo, she didn't say no.

 

If she didn't say no, then she's got to accept/share responsibility for what happened.

 

I am very much against the idea (in law) of "diminished responsibility". E.g. if you choose to get completely drunk, then you do something completely stupid, I think you have to take as much responsibility for your actions as if you had been sober. At the end of the day you still CHOSE to get drunk.

 

A guy I used to live with used to pick fights whenever he got pissed, or do stupid shit like break windows, and worse. Then the next day he'd sheepishly say, "er, sorry, I was really pissed" ... as if that's some kind of excuse. But the next night, hey presto, he'd get lashed again! Now that was a guy not taking responsibility for his own actions.

 

As for "you've got to take what's coming to you"... if you get into a state where you physically can't say no, then you're fucking stupid for getting into that state. Treza didn't say no, and from what I can make out the sex was consensual, so what is your point?

[Lisa]

my point Andy, is your comment, if you get yourself to a stae where you cant say no, then you have it coming to you!! I mean in general, not just in this case. I f I go out & get legless, that is not me say, hey guys come shag me cos I can not say NO!!!!

[LiquidEyes]

QUOTE (Lisa @ Jun 2 2004, 10:40)

If I go out & get legless, that is not me say, hey guys come shag me cos I can not say NO!!!!

Yeah but if you consent to sex with someone (i.e. they have sex with you while you're conscious and you don't say no or physically try to stop them!) then you are equally responsible for the consequences.

 

You could say the guy is "taking advantage", but it's not rape is it!

 

What I'm saying is: if you can't look after yourself when drunk, don't get drunk.

[Alex]

You have to accept that allowing yourself to drink so much, to the point where saying no can't or doesn't happen is you're own responsibility and no one elses.

[Lisa]

I do agree with that to an extent, but then in turn, it also doesnt give another human being the right to take advantage, whatever way it is.

[Alex]

QUOTE (Lisa @ Jun 2 2004, 11:00)

I do agree with that to an extent, but then in turn, it also doesnt give another human being the right to take advantage, whatever way it is.

Not arguing for that. It just happens to be a side effect of drinking so much and leaving yourself open to whatever may happen (if at all).

[LiquidEyes]

QUOTE (Lisa @ Jun 2 2004, 11:00)

it also doesnt give another human being the right to take advantage

If I leave my wallet in the street for a few hours, chances are it will have disappeared by the time I return.

 

Leaving it in the street does not give another human being the right to take advantage. However it's still fucking stupid to do so!

[Lisa]

tit for tat, now Andy, I think you know where I am coming from, in regards to your comment, the same as I know where you are comming from

 

Back to topic, smacking & punishment, I agree with it as long as it is not beating severly!!

[LiquidEyes]

QUOTE (Lisa @ Jun 2 2004, 11:29)

smacking & punishment, I agree with it as long as it is not beating severly!!

Where do you draw the line?

 

I reckon a battering round the arse with a tent peg is fine. But hitting them over the head with a garden trowl is slightly taking the piss.

[Alex]

I learnt quickly as a child that a bit of pain wasn't all that bad a punishment. Having to explain my actions and work off my indescretions, had a far bigger impact on me.

[LiquidEyes]

Agreed. My mum knew how to make me feel guilty!

Much more effective than a trowl round the head, any day.