What Are Your Views On....

[Rick D]

I married a foriegn national... OK, so I am divorced now, should she be allowed to stay in this country?

[NeoN]

toxicdave said:

have 2 disagree wiv u there dani. i work @ a busy international airport, and the amount of money grabbers that try 2 get thru immigration is appalling. we have 29 flights a week from the sub continent, and most of them claim they r here 4 a "holiday", when really they r here 2 sponge. i'm not sayin all asylum seekers r spongers, but the majority spoil it 4 the few. every other flight i work on has deportees goin bac 2 where they came from @ the expense of the airline takin them bac. it's jus not on

 

Does the airline realy shoulder the cost of it ? I think not ! I bet the cost is passed onto the fare paying passenger .

[Dani Babyboo]

1) they do not get government funding and the facts are what you chose to see before getting to know these people

2) yes i do mean people who have emigrated

3) pete i say brittish cause i am not english myself.

4) what bout brittish people who go out and live abroad should they be allowed to stay.

[Claire DC]

colin66 said:

but we're all entitled to our views so why dont u stop shooting people down with one word comments and post ur view in a rational manner like a grown up adult!!

 

Do I sense another marathon edition of 'FredtheBaddie talks back' show is on it's way?

 

 

[alasdairm]

toxicdave said:

well said that man our health service, schools and transport is crumbling around our ears, and the fukin government wud rather give our hard earned taxes 2 these sponging tossers who don't give 2 shits about the UK.

 

that's a pretty good example of the logical fallacy of the "false dilemma". to suggest that the fukin (sic.) government had to make this specific choice suggests that you really have not thought your argument through and it's based on little more than ignorance and xenophobia.

 

the entire planet is in a sorry state right now and it's small-minded thinking like this which got us there, in my opinion.

 

alasdair

[alasdairm]

toxicdave said:

 

...then we are stuck with them.

 

there's (at least) two ways to look at anything.

 

i could say that you showed up here and now we're stuck with you.

 

or i could say that you participate here and CTW is a better place because of the unique insights and experiences you bring to share.

 

which do you prefer? which is true?

 

alasdair

[alasdairm]

toxicdave said:

 

no it's not. they are of no benefit to this country wot-so-eva.

 

that's an interesting point. there are some people here - in this thread in fact - who, judging from the quality of their spelling and grammar, need more schooling.

 

i'm only guessing of course, but i don't think they'll ever be doctors. under your system, they would seem to be of little or no benefit to this country what so ever. should we maybe just have them put down and be done with it?

 

where do you draw the line?

 

alasdair

[alasdairm]

NeoN said:

Does the airline realy shoulder the cost of it ? I think not ! I bet the cost is passed onto the fare paying passenger .

 

you bet wrong.

 

generally, the deportee is expected to pay. however, given the nature of the situation we're discussing, very often the deportee owes the state the entire cost of deportation (plane ticket, cost of detention etc.).

 

whether they ever get that money is, of course, a diffierent discussion.

 

alasdair

[Claire DC]

alasdairm said:

toxicdave said:

 

...then we are stuck with them.

 

there's (at least) two ways to look at anything.

 

i could say that you showed up here and now we're stuck with you.

 

or i could say that you participate here and CTW is a better place because of the unique insights and experiences you bring to share.

 

which do you prefer? which is true?

 

alasdair

 

Errrm we're not talkin about CTW here - we're talkin about people beina drain on the country - if these immigrants went over to America they dont get the luxuries they do of bein in UK, u have to pay for ur own medical treatment, u HAVE to have somethin to offer America to be there (ie a trade, a lot of money in savings etc) before theyll even consider lettin u get a visa to stay there. So to come to the UK would probably be seen as easy for them!! There are plenty of other countries that the immigrants could go to before here but they choose not to because they wouldnt get such an easy ride there!! If its a simple case of needing to be out of the country ur bein so badly treated in, why not just get out of it to the NEAREST country to you, im sure that the UK is NOT the nearest to where these people are coming from so much as the EASIEST to get a free ride from!!

 

[Claire DC]

alasdairm said:

toxicdave said:

 

no it's not. they are of no benefit to this country wot-so-eva.

 

that's an interesting point. there are some people here - in this thread in fact - who, judging from the quality of their spelling and grammar, need more schooling.

 

i'm only guessing of course, but i don't think they'll ever be doctors. under your system, they would seem to be of little or no benefit to this country what so ever. should we maybe just have them put down and be done with it?

 

where do you draw the line?

 

alasdair

 

Again, we're not talking about this thread or clubtheworld, it isn't such a trivial issue as what you're saying and to make the comments like you have is maybe goin a bit personal to be honest. Everyone is entitiled to their views, you are included in this but i really don't see the need for cutting remarks like you have made!!

[Claire DC]

alasdairm said:

NeoN said:

Does the airline realy shoulder the cost of it ? I think not ! I bet the cost is passed onto the fare paying passenger .

 

you bet wrong.

 

generally, the deportee is expected to pay. however, given the nature of the situation we're discussing, very often the deportee owes the state the entire cost of deportation (plane ticket, cost of detention etc.).

 

whether they ever get that money is, of course, a diffierent discussion.

 

alasdair

 

and where is this information from?

[alasdairm]

Errrm we're not talkin about CTW here

 

i know that claire, that's my point - i'm just trying to show toxicdave that it's question of perspective and that there is more than one way to look at any issue whether that issue be something as (relatively) mundane as participation on a web discussion board or the question of immigration.

 

he sees it as a bunch of moneygrabbers taking the UK for a ride. there are other possible ways to look at the issue - that's all.

 

we're talkin about people beina drain on the country - if these immigrants went over to America they dont get the luxuries they do of bein in UK, u have to pay for ur own medical treatment, u HAVE to have somethin to offer America to be there (ie a trade, a lot of money in savings etc) before theyll even consider lettin u get a visa to stay there.

 

that's simply not true. the US has a welfare state system, although it's on a much smaller scale than the welfare state in certain european countries.

 

further, given that the US was built on immigration, that remains, today, a tradition: "bring me your poor, your huddled masses..." etc.

 

the US has an excellent record of offering political asylum to those seeking it. like any system, there are checks and balances and sometimes it gets a bit bogged down in its own bureaucracy.

 

there is a great deal of information on asylum on the website of the Bureau of Citizenship and Immigration Services (formerly known as the INS).

 

indeed, certain states in the US (california included) will provide certain welfare benefits even to illegal immigrants so to suggest that the UK somehow stands alone as a 'pushover' - i just don't see it.

 

alasdair

[alasdairm]

Again, we're not talking about this thread or clubtheworld

 

again, i know that - i'm just trying to draw a parallel to put my counterpoint in some kind of context closer to home.

 

it isn't such a trivial issue as what you're saying and to make the comments like you have is maybe goin a bit personal to be honest. Everyone is entitiled to their views, you are included in this but i really don't see the need for cutting remarks like you have made!!

 

i have no personal investment in this issue.

 

the point made was that people who are no benefit to this country should be refused entry. that statement asks so many more questions than it answers, doesn't it? it does to me.

 

alasdair

[alasdairm]

and where is this information from?

 

i know somebody who works in immigration so i asked him.

 

alasdair

[NeoN]

Quote:

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toxicdave said:

 

no it's not. they are of no benefit to this country wot-so-eva.

 

 

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that's an interesting point. there are some people here - in this thread in fact - who, judging from the quality of their spelling and grammar, need more schooling.

 

And who would pay for this schooling ?